Cash for Clunkers

[AmpedNow]

http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/200 ... kers_N.htm

Q: If the House bill becomes law, how would it work?

A: The government would send up to $4,500 to the selling dealer on your behalf, if you:

1. Trade in a car that — this is a key point — has been registered and in use for at least a year, and has a federal combined city/highway fuel-economy rating of 18 or fewer miles per gallon.

2. Buy a new car, priced at $45,000 or less and rated at least 4 mpg better than the old one (gets a $3,500 voucher). If the new one gets at least 10 mpg better, you get the full $4,500.

I'm really not trying to start a political thread here...but I just want to say that it sucks that those of us who chose "responsible" vehicles years ago are completely getting shafted by this program, while those of you who chose gas guzzlers are getting subsidized to buy yet another relative gas guzzler, if you wish.

Since the old vehicles must be scrapped, the next logical step to this is an outright ban on old and/or gas-guzzling vehicles, thus displacing used car lots, poor people, and those with bad credit. Or, if not an outright ban, a large "carbon tax" on them to make them not worth the hassle anyway.

Then, there's those of us who seen this oil crisis in the making years ago, and purchased fuel-efficient vehicles to help offset personal and environmental costs who, in the end, still doesn't qualify for anything...

A temporary boom for new car dealerships. A long-term headache for a sizable chunk of the population.

[genlock]

I got passed by a smart car the other day.
It seemed to run ok. Didn't sound like it was strained.
I want to see one of those Indian Ta-Tas. or 2.

[cgarison]

I am quite happy that I purchased another land yacht this spring. Hell, I already have five positions used on the odometer in just a few months and I have loved nearly every second behind the wheel. I expect that I will love it even more when I install the dual exhaust (in two months) and rear swaybar (this week). Maybe in about 50,000 miles I will opt PowerTrax locker in the differential.

And eff cash for clunkers. It is a bad program that will not help the people that need the incentive to purchase a car.

[Bob Campbell]

It's enough to fund the purchase of 250,000 cars. Should happen in 6 months or less and the auto industry will love it.

[Lester]

But we already gave them plenty of money... now more?

[Bob Campbell]

It is, I believe, a part of the package authorised earlier in the year. Not new money.

And just fyi on gov't money. The US made 23% profit on the money Goldman Sachs repaid from the TARP fund. That's not a bad 8 month investment.

[Jet Black]

Shut up, you Peons. The Great Obama knows how to redistribute your money to people who need it more than you, like new car buyers and UAWs. Submit.

[CoolBreeze]

This program was started in Germany, but I'm not sure how sucessful it's been so far.

Side note: There's a growing trend in Europe (especially Russia and Germany) for the left-wing radicals to set expensive cars on fire, especially ones that get bad gas mileage. I've been watching this now for the last year and wondering when it will arrive here.

Police Union Chief Predicts 'Renaissance of Left-Wing Terror'

In recent months, Berlin has been hit by a wave of arson attacks on cars and increasingly violent left-wing protests. This has led the head of Germany's police union to warn of a dangerous rise in left-wing terrorism, and to claim that the city of Berlin and its mayor are fanning the flames.

The headlines are there almost every morning: BMW burnt, VW set alight, a Mercedes torched. Almost nightly, somewhere in Berlin, a vehicle is set on fire in what police say are political statements by an increasingly militant left-wing. Around 170 cars have gone up in flamesthis year; and earlier this month, police vehicles became the latest targets.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/ger ... 52,00.html

[cgarison]

Shut up, you Peons. The Great Obama knows how to redistribute your money to people who need it more than you, like new car buyers and UAWs. Submit.

No. His original plan was good before it became an environmental political play to sell more small cars and fewer cars that Americans want to purchase.

[rant]

Pelosi sucks. I believe in environmental causes and have plans to change all my lights in KY to CFL (Philly has been converted) and move my electronics to switchable outlets so that power adapters are not unnecessarily consuming electricity. I support extensive and sizable rebates for the installation of solar panels and personal windmills (like the Turby) to generate power for our homes. I also want more biofuels like vegetable based diesel and E85 (I now own my second FFV car) but it is unavailable in Ashland or southeastern, PA.

Cash for Clunkers is a horrible law and the money could have been spent in ways to improve our nation and more effectively fuel the economy.

Oh! I also own my second ULEVII car. How many Hondas sold outside of California carry that rating. (Virtually none). Theoretically, my car is putting out twice as much cleaner air then a Honda Civic sold in the majority of the nation. wOOt. Long live the V8.

[/rant]

[genlock]

Let it idle all night for the environment.

[Jet Black]

No, it is a bad plan and always was a bad plan. Old, ineffecient cars kill themselves over time. It is not nearly important enough to hasten the demise of old cars by defrauding taxpayers of their hard-earned money for this bullshit program. Government should not be in the business of trying to micromanage your habits. Governement should have no say whatsoever in what car you can buy or drive. We'll all be sorry when this money-transfer program expands. So to sum up,

1. Stealing money from Taxpayers
2. Money Tranfered to Gov't Motors Corp
3. Money transfered to UAW
4. Useful cars detroyed, less cheap used cars for poor
5. No appreciable energy savings in real life
6. No appreciable polution savings in real life
7. Government Camel gets nose in tent, the power to regulate what we drive
8. Obama gets to claim he did something useful, which is a lie.

Freedom is what I want, freedom to buy the car I need and can afford, not the car that seems good for the masses to some half-assed apparatchik looking at a spreadsheet in DC. Freedom to choose the lightbulb I want to use, not some headache-inducing, noisy, mercury-filled, expensive flourescent thingy. This is none of government's business. We are stupid, so f------ stupid to let this go on.

[Bob Campbell]

We'll spend more money this week in Iraq than we spend on entire Clunkers program.
We sure don't want anybody buying new cars.
Or using less gas.
Or injecting money into the economy.
No good will come of that!

[genlock]

I think Toyota's count on the new car part.
I saw a really nice looking F-250 crew cab for sale yesterday.
4X4 and not beat up. Short bed. Not too long.
I will check it out today.

[Jet Black]

We'll spend more money this week in Iraq than we spend on entire Clunkers program.
We sure don't want anybody buying new cars.
Or using less gas.
Or injecting money into the economy.
No good will come of that!

How about beautify the countryside? All great excuses to rob the taxpayer out of $4500 more, Comrade.

[fearpeddler]

hate to laugh, but seriously, a 2nd flex fuel vehicle..... I wouldnt plan on buying the 1st till I had seen at least 2 fuel stations in my area....

[Lester]

Meanwhile, I'm perusing craiglist looking for a full-size Bronco.

[jag]

I'm afraid I don't see why this is such a contentious issue. Nobody is forcing anybody to participate. After all, you don't have to trade in your Pleistocene-sized Brougham de Chrome if you don't want to, right?

[Lester]

No, you don't have to participate... but I'm siding with JB on this: why are stupid purchasing decisions (be it banks, car manufacturers, car buyers, or home owners) the target of my tax dollars?

[Bob Campbell]

We'll spend more money this week in Iraq than we spend on entire Clunkers program.
We sure don't want anybody buying new cars.
Or using less gas.
Or injecting money into the economy.
No good will come of that!

How about beautify the countryside? All great excuses to rob the taxpayer out of $4500 more, Comrade.

Again, not new money. Part of original bailout. And if you buy a car under the program, it actually GIVES you 4500(max) in credit to new car. Try to keep up.

[Dave Allen]

Something that hasn't been mentioned is the number of dealers who are choosing not to participate. My brother-in-law works at a Toyota dealership and he said the MININUM time one can expect to be there is four hours filling out government paperwork. His dealership said "no thanks". In the meantime the dealership still has the right to turn down anyone they want.