AK Steel/Armco to lay off workers.

[Lee]

Scary, scary stuff...

http://www.wsaz.com/news/headlines/34281604.html

I know some people that work there. I hate to see anyone lose their job.

[Big Media]

Steel of WV to follow suit. They've already cut 50 or so. This is serious stuff, folks. Hang on.

Remember when we used to make fun of the Mormons for hording food?

Wish I were Mormon.

[AmpedNow]

This scotch-taped house of cash is finally coming down... Not even the feds can stop it now.

[cgarison]

This scotch-taped house of cash is finally coming down... Not even the feds can stop it now.

That is the part that is funny. GM going bankrupt have the talking heads discussing all of GMs bad policy and quality issues of the 1970's-1980s. Honestly, GM, Ford, Chrysler are going out of business because all the fleet management corporations don't have the money to purchase cars and all orders were pulled by the end of September. HEX was in the process of placing the yearly order for new Chargers when the leasing company said no. Then demanded a substantial chunk of change to cover the costs of maintenance and fuel.

[genlock]

Is HEX sorta like Heck's?

[Jet Black]

Jeepy, what do you thinks going to happen with GM? I'm a dyed-in-the-wool GM man, but I don't see any good in the taxpayer loaning them money. What would they do with it? Hold on two more quarters, then go under? I don't doubt for a minute they are not going to get the money, because that money is not to keep GM afloat but to appease the UAW for as long as it lasts. GM ought to go under, but the governmnet regulation all along the way is a good lot of the damage that's been done to GM, IMHO.

[cgarison]

GM will be just fine. Pelosi, Obama and the rest of the Union loving Dems are going to prop up the business primarily because it will be cheaper on the taxpayer to loan GM the money to continue the course of the last 8 years of righting their wrongs.

And the government has a lot to blame at this issue. Let me count the ways.

1.) Foreign governments subsidize employee health and welfare costs which GM pays as benefits
2.) Foreign governments subsidize the development of new technology like clean diesel and hybrids.
3.) CAFE standards are unrealistic when put in the scope of the entire car and the other government requirements for safer cars
4.) NHTSA has worked hard to have equal standards as the EU but make them 180 degrees different in how they are executed to prevent the same model of car being manfactured for Europe and the US.
5.) OBDII needs to die along with ODBIII which has been in proposal for the last 8 years


All of these has stacked up against the modern car company. Why does a 2009 4 banger Chevy Malibu need to have the same vehicle weight of a 1973 Ford Thunderbird witt a 460 CU V8. I certainly do not feel any safer in the new 'bu over the BigBird. And why does the Silverado 1500 need to weigh 6500 lbs? 15 years ago they were only 2 tons.

It is time for the government to drop the stupid regulations and make a standard that is a great compromise between safety and fuel economy. I know it can be done, but for now, the Feds need to bailout Ford, GM, and (DamnYour no more) Chrysler because al the problems on their desk have been put there over the last 30 years to the lack of proper leadership in Washington that refused to deal with the energy issues, medical issues, and did not protect our monetary system.

[AC Carter]

The problem is that this "loan" that the taxpayers will be forced into will never be repaid to the taxpayer. I agree that many changes in domestic policy need to be made in order for the U.S. auto industry to rebound; however, where will the "bailouts" stop? And who will bail out the taxpayers when our wells start to run dry?

[AmpedNow]

Is it finally safe to say the Japs won this battle?

If the government takes over the US auto sector, they will make Toyota and other Asian auto makers pay for having a better business model, better vehicles, and playing our own game of American capitalism better than us...

Is this what we want?

If you want to talk about unfair Japanese tariffs on our vehicles, fine. But that's the fault of the Japanese government, not their automakers.

It is also safe to say that our stuff wouldn't sell well over there anyway, because of the cultural differences between them and us. They're not impressed with Suburbans, Mustangs, and Cadillacs. While we see cool American ingenuity, they see a big waste of space and fuel.

This also explains why they have spanked Detroit for years in the compact market. To them, small cars are not "throwaways" or "starter cars" like they're considered here. Of course, $4 per gallon gas goes a long way towards erasing that mindset.

I don't like this idea...Instead of this top-down redistribution of corporate welfare, they need to try it bottom-up, and redistrubute it to the "little guy" for a change. How much better off would they be if the government gave Americans say, $10k credits toward buying a brand new American-made vehicles?

People whine that others shouldn't get something for nothing, then turn right around and support these socialist bailouts. We see how good the first one did... I heard somewhere that $6 billion of it was already set aside for CEO Christmas bonuses, and the banks are still hoarding it while the economy continues to teeter on the edge. Meanwhile, "bottom leaks" like these AK Steel layoffs are happening everywhere.

It's not populism that encourages class warfare; it's shit like this...

[cgarison]

The problem is that this "loan" that the taxpayers will be forced into will never be repaid to the taxpayer. I agree that many changes in domestic policy need to be made in order for the U.S. auto industry to rebound; however, where will the "bailouts" stop? And who will bail out the taxpayers when our wells start to run dry?

What are you talking about. The federal government always makes money on its bailout plans. Chrysler paid the Feds dearly for every penny they borrowed following there bankruptcy.

[smartass]
The repayment of these loans with interest will be the bailout of the tax payer. And what about cheap gas prices with lower taxes for highways. What about the lower prices on TVs at WalMart that have less sales tax on them because the price is down, And Wasn't that a great cut in your taxes when you lose your job and fall from that high tax bracket down to the base tax bracket.

Yep. Washington's bailout for taxpayers is built right into the recession.
[/smartass]

[cgarison]

Oh, the trickle down continues

http://money.cnn.com/2008/11/13/news/co ... 2008111314

[AC Carter]

The problem is that this "loan" that the taxpayers will be forced into will never be repaid to the taxpayer. I agree that many changes in domestic policy need to be made in order for the U.S. auto industry to rebound; however, where will the "bailouts" stop? And who will bail out the taxpayers when our wells start to run dry?

What are you talking about. The federal government always makes money on its bailout plans. Chrysler paid the Feds dearly for every penny they borrowed following there bankruptcy.

[smartass]
The repayment of these loans with interest will be the bailout of the tax payer. And what about cheap gas prices with lower taxes for highways. What about the lower prices on TVs at WalMart that have less sales tax on them because the price is down, And Wasn't that a great cut in your taxes when you lose your job and fall from that high tax bracket down to the base tax bracket.

Yep. Washington's bailout for taxpayers is built right into the recession.
[/smartass]

All hail The Recession!!!